Tasers

Well after the death of another in Winnipeg I guess we all know what the Police can do with their tasers..........that's my opinion anyway.

Cardioversion is shock therapy done with paddles just at the perfect instant to reset the rhythm of your heart. It is done in a hospital setting with all the monitors set up and with anaesthetic and doctors present. That's how dangerous using voltage on a human body is considered to be. You have to sign the papers and go without eating and all the precautions. My elderly father had this done a few months before his death.

So to use a major blast of voltage to subdue a human being without any of these precautions is certain to have repercussions. You are not aware of his/her medical conditions or weaknesses.

So, yes, people will die when blasted with many thousands of volts. And will continue to die from this form of control. We all must be aware of this possibility if we resist or act unreasonably due to alcohol or some other mental or psychological issues.

The police will have the right to subdue us using whatever means they have access to.

cricket wrote:

Well after the death of another in Winnipeg I guess we all know what the Police can do with their tasers..........that's my opinion anyway.

Protect themselves?

I am sorry, but I have little sympathy for these individuals who approach police while waving a weapon and not expecting something to happen to them.

I suppose their other method of bringing an armed individual down would have been more appealing? I think you stand a greater chance of dying from a gunshot than a taser.

maybe we should take away thier tasers... and thier night sticks and just leave them with thier Sig P229 (I believe that's what they carry) then see how these people deal with being shot with one of these as opposed to some voltage. Though it will never matter what form of restraint they use, some bleeding hearts will always find something to piss and moan over...

Did anyone see the video on the Polish guy who was teasered in the airport. I saw it on TV ....totaly unnecessary. If it was your 17 year old tasered to death would you still praise the Police for their actions. A shot in the knee or leg would for sure not take his life and for sure bring him down. If we are using them on kids why are we not using them when the natives are flashing guns and knives in Caledonia, and beating policeman, steeling their cruisers, etc etc.

I may be wrong but I believe the police are trained to shoot to kill. If they are justified in shooting someone that person would likely die. I think someone has been watching to many movies. Just shoot them in the knee ya ya that's it maybe while they are running they do it in the movies all the time.
Taser's are very useful and if used properly are very effective just like a 9 mm.

That guy who baricaded himself in a glass room? throwing chairs and tables against the window? (or are you referring to a different event) because in that case it would have been a LOT faster (and normally less lethal) to zap that guy then try and aim for a knee and miss and his an innocent bystander with a wild bullet, it's a lot harder to wound someone with a 9mm than kill them, because a kill shot can be taken on a larger area than a wound, so no shooting a guy with flailing limbs is pointless. If my 17yr old was tased an killed I would be pissed off (regardless of what he was killed with) but I would be also pissed at myself more for raising him to put himself in a position to get tased

cricket wrote:

Well after the death of another in Winnipeg I guess we all know what the Police can do with their tasers..........that's my opinion anyway.

sorry, but the kid in Winnipeg should have dropped the knife, and complied with the the officers trying to question him. They aren't just tazering on a whim, the people being tazered have committed som sort of an offence, or they wouldn't be getting tazered. The alternative is to let them escape wielding knives and robbing citizens. Tazer away I say!

I was referring to the guy in the airport..who had no weapons on him at all, no guns, knives or steel plates/bars being tossed at people ....just a wooden chair over his head. He was also tasered again when already on the ground...like I said it can kill people that do not deserve to die, (like that Polish man). He definately did not deserve to die just because he had a severe panic or anxiety attack. In this case they were within arms length to use mace or pepper spray. Nobody's life was in jeopardy and it was not a critical situation where they had to hurry up and taser him before he.....whatever.....with that chair.

cricket wrote:

I was referring to the guy in the airport..who had no weapons on him at all, unless a piece of furniture is dangerous enough is suffice to taser him. He was also tasered again when already on the ground...like I said it can kill people that do not deserve to die, (like that Polish man).

I tend to sort of agree with you in regards to the polish guy and the video that was shown.

Perhaps they were worried about him possibly injuring himself and by tasering him they could bring him under control enough to calm him down and prevent doing himself further harm?

But it is hardly fair to criticize the taser for something that may have been an error in judgement on the person deploying the taser.

Overall, the taser has been more effective at saving lives instead of using more deadly force such as a gun.

"I was referring to the guy in the airport..who had no weapons on him at all, no guns, knives or steel plates/bars being tossed at people ....just a wooden chair over his head."

It's a sad thing when someone dies of any reason, however I too saw that footage and he was throwing chairs and small tables as well as had himself barricaded in that room, why would he do something like that? I was suprised he didn't break windows with the way he was throwing things, nope it's a shame he was lost but in those officers shoes I would have done the same thing. For all they know he had serious intentions blocking himself in that room that would have harmed many more than just himself.

aguyinbrantford wrote:

"I was referring to the guy in the airport..who had no weapons on him at all, no guns, knives or steel plates/bars being tossed at people ....just a wooden chair over his head."

It's a sad thing when someone dies of any reason, however I too saw that footage and he was throwing chairs and small tables as well as had himself barricaded in that room, why would he do something like that? I was suprised he didn't break windows with the way he was throwing things, nope it's a shame he was lost but in those officers shoes I would have done the same thing. For all they know he had serious intentions blocking himself in that room that would have harmed many more than just himself.

15 hours of travel.. 10 hours of waiting in an immigrations hall (for no good reason).. not being able to communicate with people because of language barriers that would stress anyone out. I'm sure he wanted to find his mother not his grave.

aguyinbrantford wrote:

"I was referring to the guy in the airport..who had no weapons on him at all, no guns, knives or steel plates/bars being tossed at people ....just a wooden chair over his head."

It's a sad thing when someone dies of any reason, however I too saw that footage and he was throwing chairs and small tables as well as had himself barricaded in that room, why would he do something like that? I was suprised he didn't break windows with the way he was throwing things, nope it's a shame he was lost but in those officers shoes I would have done the same thing. For all they know he had serious intentions blocking himself in that room that would have harmed many more than just himself.

But society is based on the "damned it you do, damned if you don't" mentality. If the "barracading and chair throwing man" we're to have struck a 12 year old girl with a chair, the media would have ran with the " while several officers looked on a child was injured as a mad man threw chairs" finally after 45 minutes officers were able to subdue the man with only minor injuries to them selves. All of which could have been avoided if officers had of acted quicker". When they do immediately subdue a man they get the flack of the 'Tazer issue"

I do NOT think anyone should be killed, but pepper spray isn't always an option, they can't shoot at the unarmed, the tazer falls right in between. If you are warned to STOP your actions or you WILL be Tazered, then HELLO! It's time you stop your actions or you run the risk of being the Tazer fatality statistic. Lets face it, the decision to allow themselves to be tazered rests in the control of the Tazee...(if thats even a word)

Some people blamed that on the language barrier.

However, no matter the language, if someone in a uniform is pointing a taser or a gun at you, you would think that you would have enough common sense to stop what you are doing and stick your hands up showing that you intend no harm.

That is a pretty universal sign I would imagine.

I suppose they could have shot him in the knee. That would drop him as fast as a taser. And at least he might live. But he would walk with a limp.

"15 hours of travel.. 10 hours of waiting in an immigrations hall (for no good reason).. not being able to communicate with people because of language barriers that would stress anyone out. I'm sure he wanted to find his mother not his grave." no excuse... there is no language/culture that I am aware of where chair/table throwing is a form of positve communication.

"I suppose they could have shot him in the knee. That would drop him as fast as a taser. And at least he might live. But he would walk with a limp." true, but as I pointed out before, picking off a moving knee with a pistol would have been a tough shot and all that does is put you down, if still determined your arms still work, he could have been alternatively armed (knife) and pepper spray in this kind of situation has similar drawbacks. The needed him neutralized long enough to cuff him and isolate the threat, and the taser is the only weapon they have that fits that bill. Until police are equipped with the kind of weapon spiderman has (web thing) then we will always have to use a tool with some consequence.

Yeah, knee is a hard target to hit but I would imagine an exploded kneecap would pretty much hurt like a SOB.

ouch yeah I could imagine, but with all options in mind if he was on something, he may have not felt it (or as much) and would still remain a threat

Spidubic wrote:

I suppose they could have shot him in the knee. That would drop him as fast as a taser. And at least he might live. But he would walk with a limp.

and if the aim was a bit off, or because of duress the officer missed the knee.... You can't take back a bullet, once it's left the gun... if you're off target, it's GOING to hit something / one, else.

"and if the aim was a bit off, or because of duress the officer missed the knee.... You can't take back a bullet, once it's left the gun... if you're off target, it's GOING to hit something / one, else."
...and with an avatar like that I hope you don't handle guns LOL

This was on a couple of the radio talk shows today.
Police are trained to shoot for the torso-during an altercation with adrenalin flowing their accuracy drops signifigantly, making a shot ot a hand or leg very tough to do. If the person is on certain drugs they won't even feel the bullet. The taser works no matter what the impairment is.
A policeman said someone with a knife 7-10 meters away can get to you before you can get your gun out of the holster and fire. He said people don't believe this.
One other problem with an arm or leg shot-where does the bullet go after it goes through or they miss ? Oh and in a leg shot if you hit the femoral artery chances are very good they will die.

Where can I get one of these T-shirts?

Taser firm sponsoring police chiefs conference

Taser International among the major sponsors of an upcoming police chiefs conference where new research into electronic stun gun safety will be presented.

The Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police commissioned a review of conducted-energy weapons last fall after Polish immigrant Robert Dziekanski died at Vancouver International Airport when he was hit with the device by RCMP. At least five other Canadians have since died after police jolted them with electric stun guns.

Steve Palmer, executive director of the Canadian Police Research Centre, said he will present an overview of the report at the conference this month in Montreal, but said the full review of the weapons commonly known as tasers is not yet complete.

"It's an update," said Mr. Palmer, who declined to give details. A final report is expected by next year after a full and independent peer review.

Called RESTRAINT (Risk of Death in Subjects That Resist), the review compares tasers with other methods police use to subdue difficult people.

It also looks at the characteristics of those who have been zapped, including excited delirium, a condition in which suspects are in a heart-pounding state of agitation. Excited delirium has been repeatedly cited to explain the sudden deaths of people after being hit with a Taser.

Taser International is one of the platinum sponsors of the conference that runs Aug. 24-27. The corporation has sponsored similar events in Canada and around the world.

For a minimum $25,000 fee, platinum sponsors can display their name on banners and signs, provide promotional items in delegate kits, be given an advance list of participants and attend conference sessions.

Steve Tuttle, vice-president of Arizona-based Taser International, said the company's presence is important.

"You have to be there. It is a major sales event. It is advertising," said Mr. Tuttle, who will be at the conference to answer questions about his company's products.

Mr. Tuttle said that, while the new Canadian research is important, he has DVDs that contain 130 studies that have found the devices to be safe.

"You want to be there to be a conduit for information because clearly we have controversial issues in Canada, and the last thing that we want to be is shy. We stand behind our technology."

Hilary Homes of Amnesty International Canada, which has called for a moratorium on stun guns, said having Taser as a sponsor and exhibitor sends a mixed message.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/08/14/taser-police.html